So one more time, HEADERS! - Page 2 - Lexus IS Forum
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post #16 of 78 (permalink) Old 03-30-2009, 01:12 PM Thread Starter
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Unless your car has a carburetor, back pressure is always bad. Now there are some instances when loss of velocity may make you loose low end torque, ex if I used 1 7/8 primary headers on my car. But dont mistake that for loss of backpressure, rather its a loss of velocity
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post #17 of 78 (permalink) Old 03-30-2009, 01:15 PM
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gotcha thanks.
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post #18 of 78 (permalink) Old 03-30-2009, 01:18 PM
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I would just like to point out Yogi TRD made more power on an OBX shorty than a Mazzuri V1, just sayin.

Poster, I mean poster. What have I done?
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post #19 of 78 (permalink) Old 03-30-2009, 01:26 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by -Tom- View Post
I would just like to point out Yogi TRD made more power on an OBX shorty than a Mazzuri V1, just sayin.
Hmm that is very interesting!!!
I know that in theory the OBX shorty header should make the most peak HP, shorter runners make the best high-end HP usually at the expense of low-end torque. I just had some serious doubt about the merging of its collectors, or more like the dumping of its collectors into a chamber bigger than just about any header out there. Its possible that the IS300 with the stock longblock does not flow enough air for that to be a major restriction.

The other thing I wonder about is the tune and dyno. I made more power with my Megan header than I did with the Mazzuri as well on a dyno. However when I finally installed my wideband into the Mazzuri, I realized the Mazzuri flowed so much more air that I was running 16:1 or leaner air/fuel ratio with the stock ecu yanking out timing up top. The tune that gave me 12.7/12.8:1 a/f on the Megan gave me 15.7 at the richest points and 16+:1 a/f at the leaner points (I think I even ht a 17:1 at some point).
So if he did not do a complete retune, he should expect that.

The other being the dyno itself, same dyno or different ones? What were the weather conditions between runs? Yes I know sae tries to normalize it, but from years on the dyno even with sae normalization, I still see a 20rwhp difference in 30-40degree weather over 90+ degree weather. And that's AFTER SAE normalization
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post #20 of 78 (permalink) Old 03-30-2009, 01:37 PM
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my main concern with all of this, is that there are so many variables. how are we to know wetyher the mazzuri is better for people with cams, or maybe its the megan, but if you hav cams and port and polish, its the team lexus, or if you have an after market exhaust, you shouldn't use the obx. theres so many different setups, so its very easy to blow 450 on a mazzuri setup when you could go get a megan setup for 200 and make more power, there is no way to know for each person...
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post #21 of 78 (permalink) Old 03-30-2009, 01:47 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Avernier View Post
my main concern with all of this, is that there are so many variables. how are we to know wetyher the mazzuri is better for people with cams, or maybe its the megan, but if you hav cams and port and polish, its the team lexus, or if you have an after market exhaust, you shouldn't use the obx. theres so many different setups, so its very easy to blow 450 on a mazzuri setup when you could go get a megan setup for 200 and make more power, there is no way to know for each person...
That is the whole point behind this thread, educate and learn is what I am trying to do. And _TOM_ thanks for bringing up the OBX issue, I also wonder if outside of the tune, the 80mm TB Yogi has helps cos I know my car breaths so much better uptop due to the bigger TB.

Now what I can say with certainty is the Mazzuri is going to be the best for running stock camshafts. When you change the cams, now you are actually doing NA mods and not simply bolt-ons, you change VE. At this point I am not completely certain as to whether the Mazzuri or the Megan will be better. I am hoping to unravel that after I get someone to measure the diameter of the Megans and send post in this thread.

For the Team Lexus header, I will forget all about it for now. Why cos it is NOT a brand name header. It is simply used parts from the old Team Lexus racecar that they got rid off. It was never mass produced and I can think of only 3 in existence today (now the Das' old one has been found)
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post #22 of 78 (permalink) Old 03-30-2009, 02:10 PM
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If that one is making as much power as is displayed in his dyno sheet why wouldn't you want to replicate that one? Atleast get the dimension for comparison.
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post #23 of 78 (permalink) Old 03-30-2009, 03:12 PM Thread Starter
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My point is unless you can find one of the three made you are out of luck. However if it is mass produced, then we have something.
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post #24 of 78 (permalink) Old 03-30-2009, 07:35 PM
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i understand, we need to make a chart like for the boosted mods. it needs to seperate your mod list into stages... like stage 1-intake, exhaust. you need mazzuri headers... stage 2- intake, 80mm throttle body, exhaust, you need megan or mazzuri headers, stage 3- i dont know how much to include for stage 3. am i making sense?
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post #25 of 78 (permalink) Old 03-30-2009, 07:38 PM
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My point is unless you can find one of the three made you are out of luck. However if it is mass produced, then we have something.

i agree that they are not valid for this discussion. however i must say that there is talk of mass production, and if those dimensions were made public, everyone could make one or have one made and then it would be useful.
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post #26 of 78 (permalink) Old 03-30-2009, 11:44 PM
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Originally Posted by kponti View Post
That is the whole point behind this thread, educate and learn is what I am trying to do. And _TOM_ thanks for bringing up the OBX issue, I also wonder if outside of the tune, the 80mm TB Yogi has helps cos I know my car breaths so much better uptop due to the bigger TB.

Now what I can say with certainty is the Mazzuri is going to be the best for running stock camshafts. When you change the cams, now you are actually doing NA mods and not simply bolt-ons, you change VE. At this point I am not completely certain as to whether the Mazzuri or the Megan will be better. I am hoping to unravel that after I get someone to measure the diameter of the Megans and send post in this thread.

For the Team Lexus header, I will forget all about it for now. Why cos it is NOT a brand name header. It is simply used parts from the old Team Lexus racecar that they got rid off. It was never mass produced and I can think of only 3 in existence today (now the Das' old one has been found)
I think that unless the setup(variables) can be replicated by another I think it should be ignored.

Obviously there is absolutely no way to control all circumstances. Where the dyno way taken(altitude, temp, engine heatsoak, dyno differences, etc.) will always vary, but you can at least attempt to find a repeatable, fairly consistent recommended setup.

Your efforts will more than likely serve as an example for those pursuing power through mods, not those whom already have expended considerable money and effort for their numbers. I dont see many folks who already have setups ripping all their stuff off and selling to replace with new parts for another 10rwhp.

Just my opinion...

----467rwhp IS300 -sold----
---402rwhp CTS-V-sold---
--321rwhp M3 vert-sold--
-429rwhp e92 335i- 538rwhp CLS55 -
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post #27 of 78 (permalink) Old 03-31-2009, 12:50 AM Thread Starter
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^^That's the idea, when people put together their combos they can pick wisely.
But dont you think it will be easy to get rid of the mazzuri for example and get a much cheaper Megan header if that's what gives the extra power?
I may find something or nothing at all so it won't be ripping all this stuff off cars, more like match your header to your combo. So let's see, this is a simple enough experiment.
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post #28 of 78 (permalink) Old 03-31-2009, 04:28 AM
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we need someone to fab up some team lexus replicas. i'd be on that in a second. i think that the one thing keeping me from hitting 230 are my headers. either mazzuris or team lexus would do that for me for sure.

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post #29 of 78 (permalink) Old 03-31-2009, 07:17 AM
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we need someone to fab up some team lexus replicas
Why not design some headers for the BC Cams and have someone fab them up instead of trying to replicate the TL header? The TL dyno graph really doesn't impress me that much compared to any other well designed header.

Everyone that didn't buy this back when the Mazzuri header was being developed might want to now:

Amazon.com: Scientific Design of Exhaust & Intake Systems (Engineering and Performance): Philip H. Smith, John C. Morrison: Your Store

In 5 years I will have the worlds fastest IS300... because everyone else will have parted out and bought an M3.
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post #30 of 78 (permalink) Old 03-31-2009, 11:56 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by stjarvis View Post
Why not design some headers for the BC Cams and have someone fab them up instead of trying to replicate the TL header? The TL dyno graph really doesn't impress me that much compared to any other well designed header.

Everyone that didn't buy this back when the Mazzuri header was being developed might want to now:

Amazon.com: Scientific Design of Exhaust & Intake Systems (Engineering and Performance): Philip H. Smith, John C. Morrison: Your Store
Frankly unless youwanna give up any low end gains you can make with a header, the TL has the most impressive dyno graph compared to any other header out there for the IS. It holds its own against the Mazzuri in the low end, though I think the Mazzuri has it beat by a tiny margin, but it continues up top and makes the most peak power with the least drop in curve
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