Unorthodox Racing Pulley Kit - Page 2 - Lexus IS Forum
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post #16 of 34 (permalink) Old 04-30-2008, 09:07 AM
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I said the butt dyno is useless.

It helps to read -all- the words.


But I do think if you add an intake to an ISx50 you'll likely gain 0 real horsepower, since the -stock- intake already provides more air than the engine is capable of using. You'd really need some sort of controlled track testing where you compared average trap speeds to be sure though, as a static dyno with the car motionless, with the hood up and a fan blowing on it, is a horrible way to measure real gains from an air intake.

You might pick up 1% or so if you smooth the airflow with something like a Joe Z pipe though.

An exhaust? Assuming you want to stay legal you'll pick up about 2% for $600-800. Assuming you don't care about legal you can pick up 4-5% for around $1200-1500.


50 horsepower for 10000 (what you'll end up paying for a TOMs supercharger kit for an ISx50) is horrible bang for the buck too. Especially when for not much more you can gain over 100 trading up to an IS-F.



And I'm talking about engine bay braces that people buy for $100 on ebay that do NOTHING to improve the handling of the car because it's connecting parts of the car that don't actually have anything to do with handling. It's dead weight that adds nothing but bling. I'm not sure how you'd confuse an engine brace with a harmonic dampener though.

How your car -feels- is meaningless compared to what you can measure as actually improving.

Many folks spend $300 on an intake for their IS350 and they're sure it "feels" faster but all they did was spend $300 to make the car louder (and possibly slower via heatsoak from running an open element filter).

My last car had over 500 hp by the way. Naturally aspirated. I think I know a little about how to build for -actual- performance, not "feels like it's fast!" performance.


The ISx50 is the wrong car to buy if you're interested in modding the hell out of it for added performance though... there's simply not much gains to be had from any of the common mods, and FI is extremely difficult to do at all, and near impossible to do in a cost effective manner.

The best way to make an IS250 significant faster remains- trade it in for an IS350. If you'd rather drop a few grand on mods you might be luck enough to pick up 10-20% if you don't mind being illegal.

The best way to make an IS350 significantly faster remains- trade it in for an IS-F. If you'd rather spend a few grand on mods you might pick up 5-7% if you don't care about being illegal.


But to get this whole thing back on point- an un-dampened crank pulley is a bad idea, don't do it. They put a dampener on the car for a reason. Unless you're planning to get rid of the car in a relatively short period of time and don't mind screwing the next owner so you could gain 5-10 horsepower for a while, then go ahead.
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post #17 of 34 (permalink) Old 04-30-2008, 01:48 PM
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interesting thread
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post #18 of 34 (permalink) Old 05-09-2008, 04:10 PM
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ya.. everyone in here pretty much has the right idea. No pulley kits for me. You may not think they damage anything, but its the silence that kills the motor. hahaha

smaller pulleys = harder work = more stress. I dont really think it matters if they are lighter weight though. Regardless if your pulley weighs 25 lbs compared to 2 lbs, the motor is still turning those functions at the speed their internals will allow, correct?

i say... just turbo the damn thing <333 go out with a bang!
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post #19 of 34 (permalink) Old 05-09-2008, 05:09 PM
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"sigh"....ISX50 owners are better than us 1st gen guys.....destron25, lets go before they start calling us low buget for owning is300's...

"middle finger"

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post #20 of 34 (permalink) Old 05-09-2008, 05:12 PM
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Originally Posted by jaidedeye View Post
"sigh"....ISX50 owners are better than us 1st gen guys.....destron25, lets go before they start calling us low buget for owning is300's...

"middle finger"

lol take me with you.
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post #21 of 34 (permalink) Old 05-09-2008, 05:27 PM
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HMMM....someone has an alt-nic on here..this is a message on some rep i got

internet tough guy...wonder who sent me this...thye obviously have another screen name on here

here is the message i got:


URSMOKD: a little FYI fuckface. i own an IS300, and if you knew who i was you wouldnt be - rep'in me.

Staff Sergeant USAF
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2010 Mazdaspeed 3
2009 CX-7
88 mustang 5.0 coupe
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post #22 of 34 (permalink) Old 05-09-2008, 05:41 PM
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hmmm... and p.s. dont -rep me for being lovely.

and just curious... how do you give -rep when you are banned and have a gazillion negative rep?? lol
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post #23 of 34 (permalink) Old 05-09-2008, 05:45 PM
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PM'd barkat about URSMOKD posting even though he is banned with an alt-nic. im sure who ever it is on this thread will disappear

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post #24 of 34 (permalink) Old 05-09-2008, 05:48 PM
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Originally Posted by jaidedeye View Post
PM'd barkat about URSMOKD posting even though he is banned with an alt-nic. im sure who ever it is on this thread will disappear

im sure whoever he is a) keeps on topic and isnt a whiney bitch. and b) can create lets say... 5382 alt-nics and no one can ever stop him/her ? haha

blame it on me. i rub off on people.
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post #25 of 34 (permalink) Old 05-09-2008, 11:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tricc View Post
im sure whoever he is a) keeps on topic and isnt a whiney bitch. and b) can create lets say... 5382 alt-nics and no one can ever stop him/her ? haha

blame it on me. i rub off on people.
haha..barkat banned your ass.......your real screen name is URSMOKD...

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post #26 of 34 (permalink) Old 05-09-2008, 11:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Tricc View Post

smaller pulleys = harder work = more stress.
To my understanding they make (for the is300) pulleys that are the same size (ie diameter) as stock minus the weight of course. This involves no underdriving of the accessories... I am sure they can do the same for the ISX50

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Originally Posted by Tricc View Post
I dont really think it matters if they are lighter weight though. Regardless if your pulley weighs 25 lbs compared to 2 lbs, the motor is still turning those functions at the speed their internals will allow, correct?
I think it does matter if their are lighter weight... some guy, LONG time ago, came up with a formula about rotational kinetic energy and inertia... total Energy = Rotational + Translational...since the pulleys are just spinning in place translation = 0.

So its all about rotational kinetic energy, which equals 0.5*Inertia*angular velocity^2...

well anyways inertia for a pulley (solid disc) is 0.5*mass*radius^2 ...
*to sum it up*

To reduce the energy lost (ie energy to turn a pulley) either
1.) reduce the mass (ie keep the stock diameters) there by reducing rotational mass
2.) reduce the radius (ie underdrive it)
3.) both

Results from reducing the amount of energy required to turn something is that the engine doesn't have to "waste" energy running them (ie the accessory pulleys)

You would get the most performance (HP gains) from reducing the weight and radius of the crank pulley, but the issue with the harmonic balancing is a WHOLE SEPERATE issue. I actually know that inline 6 are the most balanced engines next to V12s... I just don't think there is enough data to prove or disprove that crank pulleys w/o harmonic balancers harm or do not harm the engine.

Also, to my knowledge reducing 1 pound of rotational mass is like losing 3-5 of static mass and every pound "lighter" your car is the fast it can accelerate. F=ma

^^ you can thank my mechanical engineering classes for the info above!



don't know how underdriving effects the car BUT I don't see how reducing the rotational mass will effect it...

I personally run the accessory pulleys for the is300, not the crank one...

JUST MY 2 pesos.

Last edited by jroring; 05-09-2008 at 11:53 PM.
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post #27 of 34 (permalink) Old 05-10-2008, 07:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tricc View Post
ya.. everyone in here pretty much has the right idea. No pulley kits for me. You may not think they damage anything, but its the silence that kills the motor. hahaha

smaller pulleys = harder work = more stress. I dont really think it matters if they are lighter weight though. Regardless if your pulley weighs 25 lbs compared to 2 lbs, the motor is still turning those functions at the speed their internals will allow, correct?

i say... just turbo the damn thing <333 go out with a bang!
I hate it when someone with little to no automotive knowledge says crap like this. Please do some research....Them pulleys you are talking about are the same size diameter as the stock ones that is why you can use the stock belts. If you know anything about power to weight ratio then you know there will be a gain. Like I said before, you do not gain HP, you are just restoring some HP the engine has lost from having accessories like AC, Alternator, Power steering and etc. By making the pulleys lighter you are taking some load off and that is why you will notice more power. I do have the crank pulleys and have no problems whatsoever. -rep

-HKS-VOLK RACING-ROTORA-TEIN-JIC-LTUNED
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post #28 of 34 (permalink) Old 05-11-2008, 08:36 PM
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Originally Posted by destron25 View Post
Them [Those] pulleys you are talking about are the same size diameter as the stock ones that is why you can use the stock belts.
I believe Unorthodox makes some that are smaller diameters... these underdrive the accessories and and take less energy to power...
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post #29 of 34 (permalink) Old 05-12-2008, 07:36 AM
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First- the ISx50 (this is the second gen section of the forum, right?) isn't a straight 6, it's a V. Using an undampened crank pulley on it is flat out stupid unless your plan is to sell the car before you ruin the engine completely and hope the next owner doesn't come looking for you.

Second- yes using a different accessory pulley (NOT crank pulley) is probably perfectly safe if it's the same diameter but lighter. But you're going to save so little with that it's probably not worth developing a part just to do it.

The ISx50 doesn't have a power steering pump, and it shuts off the AC at WOT, so the only thing you're really "saving" on is turning the alternator. If you really want to develop a part and spend a bunch of money so you might pick up 1-2 horsepower, I guess go for it.
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post #30 of 34 (permalink) Old 05-12-2008, 12:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jroring View Post
I believe Unorthodox makes some that are smaller diameters... these underdrive the accessories and and take less energy to power...
THey have both. Probably would not put pulleys on the second generation IS until more real world testing is done.

-HKS-VOLK RACING-ROTORA-TEIN-JIC-LTUNED
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